Do you think many of the MTT regs. online are using PE?

[Poker Stacker]

Question here... guesstimation really I suppose.
As you never hear anyone talking of using PE in the poker forums (well, occassionally you do, mostly by noobs unecessarily bringing attention to themselves imo) I'm wondering how many of the MTT regs. are using it or are most just using PT3 & HEM?? (when referring to 'regs' I mean the higher buyin mtt regs. & also the mid-stakes buyins (ie. $50>$109)).

Watching numerous coaching/training vids., I've seen a bunch of players using addtional stuff like topshark (along with HUD from HEM/PT3) but have often wondered if they're using PE (I hear may who warn players to not use it.... but wondering if they perhaps use it themselves?).

I've been a lurker for awhile now, wanting to invest in PE but not wanting to do so unless I'm going to put in the time to get the most out of it and get some volume in (I'm sure once I get started with it, I"ll be sold and will be a lifer). Looking back, I should've just got it a long time ago but with so many other committments on my path, I've never thought I was going to have much time to play but then seem to get in a bit of play anyways, lol.

just curious to other's thoughts on this..... or do ya figure most PE users are playing cash tables?

[northerner53]

There are so many players that you don't run into a lot of PE users at least I have not. I have been playing 20 & up SNG and MTT lately and have only seen one that I was pretty sure about (13000 + hands) and 3 or 4 possibles (3000 + hands)
In the last two years I have not run into more than 10 or 15 people also using PE

[powernewf]

The cash games are much more extensively mined than tournaments but there are some decent amounts of stats on mtts. I consider it a good thing that you would not see very many PE'ers on the tables because it means that you have that edge over them. With HEM or PT, you only get your own stats, with PE, you get more than that!

[Poker Stacker]

The cash games are much more extensively mined than tournaments but there are some decent amounts of stats on mtts. I consider it a good thing that you would not see very many PE'ers on the tables because it means that you have that edge over them. With HEM or PT, you only get your own stats, with PE, you get more than that!

Isn't pretty much every hand played mined by PE? More hands are mined on the cash tables then the tourney tables?? I had no idea about this.
I'm familiar with the differences between PE & PT3/HEM. Why wouldn't more players be using PE than there are? Surely they've all heard of it. It seems like it'd be far superior.

[Poker Stacker]

There are so many players that you don't run into a lot of PE users at least I have not. I have been playing 20 & up SNG and MTT lately and have only seen one that I was pretty sure about (13000 + hands) and 3 or 4 possibles (3000 + hands)
In the last two years I have not run into more than 10 or 15 people also using PE

How can you tell if another player is a PE user when you're playing on a table? (are you able to block your stats. once you're a member, but also be able to discern the difference from someone who might just be a new player online).

My experience online, it 'seems like' there are so many players (well..there are alot of players) but the number of regs. is nowhere near as high as I used to assume at one point. Once I'd played for a year or so, I began to see alot of the same names on the same tables. I've also spent a fair bit of time grinding private forum tourneys (micro buyin cash-added whore) and that group is really small (it's all the same people playing for all of the different forums and on all the different sites.

[powernewf]

Isn't pretty much every hand played mined by PE? More hands are mined on the cash tables then the tourney tables?? I had no idea about this.

That is only my experience but I am 99% a cash player so I guess I have a little bias here...maybe Paul or JT can answer this better than I.

I'm familiar with the differences between PE & PT3/HEM. Why wouldn't more players be using PE than there are? Surely they've all heard of it. It seems like it'd be far superior.

It comes down to a one-time fee or a recurring monthly subscription. For me, the expanded stats that I get from PE's central database is definitely worth my monthly fee, but again that is my opinion. PE does not provide the in-depth self-analysis that PT can however I do know of some members who use both software packages.

[powernewf]

Yes, when you are a member, you can hide your stats... your icons will still show but nobody but you will be able to see your stats.

Hope this helps,
PN

[Poker Stacker]

Yes it does help... tks.

Okay so I'm pretty sure I'm going to spring for PE, goal being Monday of next week (I'm MTT multi-tabling on the weekends and don't want to have to be spending too much time familiarizing myself with the PE set up).

Still curious as to what hands are mined. I've always figured that just all hands were mined??

[powernewf]

Only holdem is mined. If you were mining say 1% with PT, PE would be mining probably 4%...it's not total coverage. Total coverage would certainly provide an unfair advantage that would cause a lot of people to get on board, thus negating the advantage and stirring up the ire of the poker gods. That's a vicious cycle I don't want to get in!

[northerner53]

If a player has an icon( bomb, shrark etc.) but the stats are all zero n/a
they are using PE
if the stats aren't blocked and they have 5000 or more tracked hands there is a good chance they are using or at least have used PE in the past

[Bob12345]

Yes, when you are a member, you can hide your stats... your icons will still show but nobody but you will be able to see your stats.
PN

If this is true, then why can't a member of a poker site's security team join Poker-Edge and then simply start clicking on tables and find all the players whose stats don't show up and then ban those players? Am I missing something here?

[JohnnyTropic]

Yes, when you are a member, you can hide your stats... your icons will still show but nobody but you will be able to see your stats.
PN

If this is true, then why can't a member of a poker site's security team join Poker-Edge and then simply start clicking on tables and find all the players whose stats don't show up and then ban those players? Am I missing something here?

Dude, they have more important things to do than join 50 different programs and sit and scan every table every day all day. Get real.

[Bob12345]

Yes, when you are a member, you can hide your stats... your icons will still show but nobody but you will be able to see your stats.
PN

If this is true, then why can't a member of a poker site's security team join Poker-Edge and then simply start clicking on tables and find all the players whose stats don't show up and then ban those players? Am I missing something here?

Dude, they have more important things to do than join 50 different programs and sit and scan every table every day all day. Get real.

According to the TOS, they can confiscate the money in your account. and you would have no recourse. Sounds kind of risky to me... Is hiding stats an option that can be turned off? I think it would be best if the hide statistics were an option with the default turned off so that individuals using Poker-Edge could not be easily identified. Also, it should collect stats on a Poker-Edge player in the exact same way that it collects for all the other players. Or at least there should be an option for it to do that. No reason why Poker-Edge players should be giving more info to other Poker-Edge players or any additional info that can be used to identify them as using Poker-Edge. So for example, if there was no showdown, but you can see the hole cards of the player that won the pot (and you know that he did not press the show cards button) - it would not be hard to figure out that this player has to be using Poker-Edge.

With this concern in mind, can Poker-Edge be used on a different computer than the one that you are playing on? So, in other words you would play on one computer and use Poker-Edge on another computer by connecting to the poker site and then opening the table that you are sitting at. The poker site might still be somewhat suspicious if they detected that the same I/P address was connecting to the same table. So, to counter this, a 2nd computer could connect via a different method than the computer used to play. For example, if connecting via cable modem for the playing computer, then connect the Poker-Edge computer via dial-up. There would be several advantages of doing this - the poker site could not ban the account and confiscate funds if it somehow detects Poker-Edge on it. It would guarantee that no additional hand history info would make it into the Poker-Edge DB other than what other players see. And lastly, it would guarantee that no kind of trojan or other malware (with or without the knowlege of Poker-Edge) in the Poker-Edge software could ever be used to read a player's hole cards. I'm not suggesting that Poker-Edge would ever knowingly do this, but trojans have been added to some major software companies download software in the past without their permission or knowledge.

[paul123]

Hey Bob,

I have been moderator here for a couple years now and to the best of my knowlege, there has never been a player who lost their BR because they were caught using PE. All PE does is datamine a site. The sites don't like this and consider it an unfair advantage but handle that different than actual cheating.

PE does not block your username unless you ask it too. It is not automatic. Instructions for hiding and unhiding stats are in the how to section. As for the stats, they are tracked for a user just like they are for a non user. If the hand does not go to showdown, the hole cards remain unknown to other users.

At most sites, you do not have to be seated for stats to appear so yes, you could run PE from a seperate computer if you wished but you have to make sure you don't have PE installed on your playing computer because some sites scan (or used to) scan your hard drive and if you load the site without using PE, it is possible for it to be detected.

Hope that helps some.

[John007]

hey Bob

are you a pessimistic poker player please join me time you make your descision you would have been timed out

All the best and watch out ive heard ncis are on the case now

john